N12Turbo.com lanyards are now available! Click here to visit the shop
What are people's thoughts on boost controllers?
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
What are people's thoughts on boost controllers?
I'm currently running a cheaPish tee type. Should I switch to an electronic? Maybe with hi/low boost? For now I'm only running 8 psi in a high flow but I'd like to run a bit more.. [/list]
Too much is never enough..
- poeticjustice88
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:24 am
- Location: gold coast, queensland
i dont see the point in electronic. even the crappy GFB boost tees provide suitable and regulated boost pressure.
Dual stage boost controllers, again i dont see the point. if you dont want the boost, dont put your foot down. i am running a simple GFB boost tee and have no problems. I also ran the sam type on my BPT TX3 laser and had no problems. When i had my S4 RX7 with a 13BBPT i had electronic, and it fluctuated an amazing amount more than the manual versions.
Just stick with a tee.
Michael
Dual stage boost controllers, again i dont see the point. if you dont want the boost, dont put your foot down. i am running a simple GFB boost tee and have no problems. I also ran the sam type on my BPT TX3 laser and had no problems. When i had my S4 RX7 with a 13BBPT i had electronic, and it fluctuated an amazing amount more than the manual versions.
Just stick with a tee.
Michael
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
- poeticjustice88
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:24 am
- Location: gold coast, queensland
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
- poeticjustice88
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:24 am
- Location: gold coast, queensland
An ecu that controls the boost say for instance a haltech, have an optional controller that are $150..You can tune to boost by gear etc..But back on topic, If your wanting just a single stage controller, then simply go a turbotech, about $39 on ebay, shops locally near you may sell them, they are simply the best single stage boost controller, no spiking EVER!..Shits all over the high end names such as turbosmart, GFB etc etc..As for a dual stage, I wouldn't recommend anything other than a turbosmart Eboost2 controller, Their about $800-$900 new, Fucking fantastic things, I'm currently running one in my 180sx on 18psi & it hits it hard & holds with no fluctuation what so ever!..With the Eboost2 you can control how the boost comes on, as in, early, late & how hard it hits, you can change the way it comes on, so you can make it come on slow & smooth, or fast & hard...Little bit difficult to setup on the streets but quite easy on the dyno as you need to change a few values & a lot of trial and error, but once setup correctly, they are effing awesome!..
My old exa I created from granny spec to a neat little BRIGHT car: http://forum.n12turbo.com/viewtopic.php?t=3903
Current Car: 2004 Vz SS Ute
Current Car: 2004 Vz SS Ute
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
Been crappy weather so i only got to take a look today, picture below is from under the car, I'm assuming this is my wastegate? after i change my HG im thinking about adding a boost tee and maybe taking the boost up from 8psi to maybe 10 or 12? I'm a little confused about what my safe-ish pressures are as my turbo has been high flowed by the previous owner. He said "Running 8psi same power as factory at 15psi" I understand how a high flow works but i cant get a straight answer as to what the motor will take from this turbo.. if that makes any sense. :/
BTW its a T25g i believe that has been high flowed..
BTW its a T25g i believe that has been high flowed..
Too much is never enough..
- poeticjustice88
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:24 am
- Location: gold coast, queensland
i am running the same turbo (for now, grrrrr) and make has a different inlet flange, i know that turbos can come with any type of inlet flange, but i was under the assumption that the 25G only came with the male flange. 2 bolts instead of a hose over.
Michael
P.S. Mine is not highflowed and I am pushing 15 PSI through it.I do have microtech ECU however.
Michael
P.S. Mine is not highflowed and I am pushing 15 PSI through it.I do have microtech ECU however.
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
I know it's a t25. Thought it was a g but I could be wrong. Looked at a few cars when I brought this so I could be confusing specs lol.
So is that round thing the wastegate?
Also when I say it's running 8psi.. Is that the pressure the motor sees or the turbo.
Purely for argument-
As in is my high flow 8 the same as ur regular say 12? I'm just a bit confused in this issue
So is that round thing the wastegate?
Also when I say it's running 8psi.. Is that the pressure the motor sees or the turbo.
Purely for argument-
As in is my high flow 8 the same as ur regular say 12? I'm just a bit confused in this issue
Too much is never enough..
- poeticjustice88
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:24 am
- Location: gold coast, queensland
what the turbo sees and what the engine sees should be identical i believe, a difference of a fraction of a PSI may be seen but should be the same.
the round thing is your wastegate
look at it this way. a high flowed turbo is technically a bigger turbo. your 8 and my 8 should be about the same, but you would probably get on boost faster, as it is sucking more air through a bigger intake and spinning faster
Michael
the round thing is your wastegate
look at it this way. a high flowed turbo is technically a bigger turbo. your 8 and my 8 should be about the same, but you would probably get on boost faster, as it is sucking more air through a bigger intake and spinning faster
Michael
- tassuperkart
- Administrator
- Posts: 5578
- Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:39 pm
- Location: Southern Tasmania
- Contact:
Ok it sort of "looks like a T25. As a rule, the G's usually have a bolt on inlet snout......as a rule.
Most likely scenario is that the turbo is fitted with a larger T25G back housing.
You cant swap to a larger front housing as the compressor wheel is different between the two turbos.
Now, the subject of "oh my turbo is highflowed so my 8psi has more airflow than yours so mine is more powerful" subject comes around fairly regularly.
Its just not right....mostly.
Now, heres the thing, the ENGINE is the demand/bottleneck and it ALONE determines airflow at a given psi.
Remember psi has a direct influence on airflow but it is NOT proportional
For a given engine, you CANNOT vary the airflow without varying the air pressure so the old furfy just flies out the window.
The only time the turbo will run out of puff is when the engine demands enough airflow (at a given psi pressure) to exceed the turbos ability to generate that psi and so the turbo will simply become a restriction in both the inlet and outlet (zorst) systems.
As the demand for flow increases, the compressor overspeeds and becomes very inneficient, the turbine becomes a "potato in the tailpipe".
Where a better chosen turbo setup comes into play is when the turbocharger creates *blah* psi more efficiently, cooler discharge airtemps and more efficient use of exhaust gas HEAT and so less backpressure between the engine and turbo.
Result is more available horsepower from a given psi boost.
Remember, you can throttle and engine on the exhaust side just as you can throttle in on the inlet side!!! No air gets out, no air gets IN!
Bottom line is, 8psi is 8psi is 8psi when the ENGINE is the sole user of the pressure and airflow.
A tiny little GT15 will flow sifficiently to boost to 10psi on an E15et but will most likely be way out of its efficiency range, or "Off the map" and the engine then becomes a compressor, trying to force the exhaust gas thru the tiny turbine and the little compressor will be basically becoming an inneficient air heater raising the inlet temps sky high (lowing air density and so the power of the BANG) and just becoming an ever increasing load on the poor turbine which ia already oversped and already restricting air getting OUT of the engine!
So, go the "highflow" option, say fit a GT17 and all of a sudden at 10 psi boost on the same engine, the turbo is now right "On the map", the turbine is actually recovering and reusing exhaust heat WITHOUT clogging up the exhaust and the compressor wheel is generating the airflow easily and with minimal load on the turbine and minimal rise in airtemps.
= MOAR POWAH for the same boost pressure!!!!!!!!
However, the bigger turbo will spool SLOWER and LAG LATER than the non-highflowed option.
And THAT is about as simple as it can get.
Oracle
Most likely scenario is that the turbo is fitted with a larger T25G back housing.
You cant swap to a larger front housing as the compressor wheel is different between the two turbos.
Now, the subject of "oh my turbo is highflowed so my 8psi has more airflow than yours so mine is more powerful" subject comes around fairly regularly.
Its just not right....mostly.
Now, heres the thing, the ENGINE is the demand/bottleneck and it ALONE determines airflow at a given psi.
Remember psi has a direct influence on airflow but it is NOT proportional
For a given engine, you CANNOT vary the airflow without varying the air pressure so the old furfy just flies out the window.
The only time the turbo will run out of puff is when the engine demands enough airflow (at a given psi pressure) to exceed the turbos ability to generate that psi and so the turbo will simply become a restriction in both the inlet and outlet (zorst) systems.
As the demand for flow increases, the compressor overspeeds and becomes very inneficient, the turbine becomes a "potato in the tailpipe".
Where a better chosen turbo setup comes into play is when the turbocharger creates *blah* psi more efficiently, cooler discharge airtemps and more efficient use of exhaust gas HEAT and so less backpressure between the engine and turbo.
Result is more available horsepower from a given psi boost.
Remember, you can throttle and engine on the exhaust side just as you can throttle in on the inlet side!!! No air gets out, no air gets IN!
Bottom line is, 8psi is 8psi is 8psi when the ENGINE is the sole user of the pressure and airflow.
A tiny little GT15 will flow sifficiently to boost to 10psi on an E15et but will most likely be way out of its efficiency range, or "Off the map" and the engine then becomes a compressor, trying to force the exhaust gas thru the tiny turbine and the little compressor will be basically becoming an inneficient air heater raising the inlet temps sky high (lowing air density and so the power of the BANG) and just becoming an ever increasing load on the poor turbine which ia already oversped and already restricting air getting OUT of the engine!
So, go the "highflow" option, say fit a GT17 and all of a sudden at 10 psi boost on the same engine, the turbo is now right "On the map", the turbine is actually recovering and reusing exhaust heat WITHOUT clogging up the exhaust and the compressor wheel is generating the airflow easily and with minimal load on the turbine and minimal rise in airtemps.
= MOAR POWAH for the same boost pressure!!!!!!!!
However, the bigger turbo will spool SLOWER and LAG LATER than the non-highflowed option.
And THAT is about as simple as it can get.
Oracle
Forcd4 wrote:Oh fuk no dude it's you a again, the oracle.
-
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:47 pm
Firstly.. how do u know all this stuff?? lol
Ah thanks guys it makes a whole lot more sense now. So if I ever did increase boost it really just means I could go a touch higher than normal without overworking the turbo.. And yeah it can be a little laggy but it's not too bad.
As for the waste gate controlling the boost pressure should I be installing a tee or just leaving it be?
Ah thanks guys it makes a whole lot more sense now. So if I ever did increase boost it really just means I could go a touch higher than normal without overworking the turbo.. And yeah it can be a little laggy but it's not too bad.
As for the waste gate controlling the boost pressure should I be installing a tee or just leaving it be?
Too much is never enough..